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MaseratiForumMaserati CarsA6G-Merak, BiTurbo era, Ghibli, QP IV Considering a Ghibli - anyone know anything about this one?

Considering a Ghibli - anyone know anything about this one?

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2/1/2009 12:15:22  
 

Posts: 55
Since: 2/1/2009
Status: offline 		Hello

i've hankered after a Ghibli since seeing my mates landlord's early Ghibli ABS in about 1997 and am now in a position to think about buying one.  I've read some of the other threads about what to look for and have accumulated a number of road tests and buying guides from various magazines so I like to think I know a bit about them.  I've seen a few for sale lately but most have not been to my taste as they are either bright colours or autos (I'd like a manual GT in a restrained colour)    I recently found this one:

http://users.autoexposure.co.uk/details6.cfm?Account=AETA24236&VehicleID=AETV67314386&Image=http://users.autoexposure.co.uk/is/autoedit/AETA24236/AETV67314386_1c.jpg

What I wondered is does anyone know this car?  Does the price look ok or is it a bit cheap?  It looks like its in nice condition and seems to have had some money spent on it - exhaust looks aftermarket, maybe a Larini or Modena Performance?

I would be keen to get the car inspected by someone who knows the cars, I looked at Bill McGraths website and I see they do inspections but require the car to be taken to them (the car is in Newcastle so its too far unfortunately).  Anyone know anyone who would go and take a look for me?

The other thing I wondered was that are these hard cars to sell should I need to sell mine in a few years time as some seem to be on the market for ages (or is that because they're bad ones eg that minging bodykitted one thats been on Pistonheads a few times, or the rosso oriente ex Evo car thats a bit rusty)?

How is the parts availability bearing in mind these cars have been out of production for a fair while now? (I'm currently rebuilding an Alfa Romeo 33 from a similar era and getting parts is a nightmare so I'm hoping the Maser won't be the same)

Thanks for any help you can provide

Rich
2/1/2009 12:58:29  

Posts: 4164
Since: 5/6/2007
Status: offline 		Hi Dicky and welcome to the forum, good choice of car but not my cup of tea, parts should not be too much of a problem, a few good sources around #

Eurospares.co.uk   Good for new and some 2nd hand parts
David Askews        good for 2nd hand parts  and refurbished parts
Main stealers

Nearest guy i know near to you is Andy at Millbrook cars  Sheffield

nice guy  and well worth a try

regards lozcb


_____________________________

Old pompous spods current stable
52 plate 4200 cc Lowered Tubi's and full GS body kit,steering wheel and rack
55 plate 4200 cc Gransport Full Larini system,AP Racing big brake upgrade ,more stuff pending

2/1/2009 13:48:02  


Posts: 2135
Since: 11/5/2005
Status: offline 		Hi Rich,

Welcome to the forum and a good choice in cars, The Ghibli does not resell well because it is tainted with the reputation of the preceding biturbos which where thought to be a poor move away from the Maserati supercars of the seventies and worse they are all prone to rust due to the poor quality of steel used.

The Ghibli is a truly fantastic car, supercar performance in sheeps clothing it attracts admiring attention wherever it goes....looks like a 1980's Honda on steroids but...................

Rich (Chad5k1) and I co own one...(his Mum is my partner)....he bought it from me when I bought the Spyder and then I bought a half share back when he needed to "modernise" to get in line with "company policy" As the value was so little and we had each spent a lot on it! Although we have now stripped it and run it a s a track / fun car. Frankly they do not resell well at all...because of the rust issues and the parts / servicing costs. Easy to buy but few have the budget to run one maybe £2000 a year for modest mileage. THEY ARE WORTH FROM £4k upto what the buyer is prepared to pay, mainly around £6 to £7K. But if you are happy with the car and it is right then an little extra may save you some serious expense later, but have it checked. It is not about mileage but body work mainly with a proper dealer / specialist history...there were only 132 right hand cars made and that includes the worldwide market. The best knowledge is available here:

http://www.maserati-alfieri.co.uk/alfieri00a.htm

Enrico owns perhaps the best in England...He only takes it out in the dry oin warm days and after washing chases all the water out with an airleine.

Or e mail David Askew:

http://web.onetel.net.uk/~davidaskew/maserati/

Ours is kept tip top mechanically by Emblem in Bournemouth and McGraths have done good work previously when it was with Rich in the Thames Valley. Parts wise it can be difficult to source some parts but most bit's are still available.

It is very very important that it is serviced by someone who understands them!

The Engines are pretty tough units but the chains need changing at around 48K or when they become noisy. The turbos are reliable as long as they are given time to cool off before switching off....knowledge of the previous owners care is a must!Re the rust....everywhere floor pan, all enclosed sections; inner cills, door bottoms, under door mirrors, base of windscreen pillars, bulkhead behind bonnet hinges, bonnet under grille boot lid.......always from the inside out...when you can see be sure that you have a nextensive problem!

We have to address the body work on ours for the second time in about six years this year!!!!!

I hope that doesn't put you off! I think they are great and there are probably less than 90 rhd cars left at a guess most will be known cars if you ask enough questions.

Hope that throws some light on the subject.......

_____________________________

"Maser Malc"!!
4200 Spyder CC
Ghibli ABS
Mercedes ML320
www.essentialimages.co.uk



2/1/2009 15:03:04  
 

Posts: 55
Since: 2/1/2009
Status: offline 		i
quote:

ORIGINAL: lozcb

Hi Dicky and welcome to the forum, good choice of car but not my cup of tea, parts should not be too much of a problem, a few good sources around #



Do you not like Ghiblis in general or is it just this particular one thats not your cup of tea?  I admit I wouldn't choose a green one if I was buying new but unfortunately in the second han market I think condidtion is more important than colour.  Thanks for the advice about parts suppliers, you've reassured me a bit in that department, I had a look at David Askew's website, I remember the Ghibli he had for sale when it was listed on ebay, I seem to remember it had quite a bit of rust.  Are his prices reasonable?


Thanks for all the info Malcolm, I'm familiar with Italian rust issues as I have 2 Alfa Romeos and it drives me mad, ironically the newest one is worse than the older one!  I think prevention is the best method with Italian cars, I certainly wouldn't consider a car with a lot of rust.  What did you think of the Green car by the way?  Seems like a reasonable price and I know its been for sale for a while so a deal might be there.  With regards to selling, its not necessarily a problem that they're hard to sell, I wouldn't be in a hurry to sell a nice car, it would just be reassuring to know I could claw back a bit of money if i needed to.  I would imagine that although there's a limited market, people will always be prepared to pay good money for a good car?

With regards to servicing, its a bit bleak here (I live near Cardiff), we have Dick Lovett, a main dealer for Porsche, Ferrari and Maserati but I'm not sure if they'd cope with a Ghibli, I was thinking of using Bob Houghton (www.bobhoughtonferrari.co.uk) as they also specialise in Maserati and are not too far away (I've seen an original Ghibli there as well as a couple of Meraks and a Bora).  Anyone know of them?  I know they have a good reputation with Ferrari....

Thanks for your help, its nice to find such a friendly and informative site

Rich

< Message edited by dickyb -- 2/1/2009 15:05:28 >
2/1/2009 15:08:23  
 

Posts: 214
Since: 22/3/2007
Status: offline 		Evening,

I have a Cup, and in 2 years off ownership have had no real issues with it.

I have had exhausts made
An electric window stopped working
the rev counter seems not to work on warm days !!!

We use it every weekend when weather permits, always driven as intended, and the engine/turbos/gearbox have been fine.

if you test drive it, check that everything works, move the shocks through all setting a couple of times and make sure the windows go all the way down and back up.

We are obviously biased and it may not quite be the fastest car out there, but it always attracts attention, and would not hesitate recommending one. This one has been up for sale for a while but looks clean, check the chains have been done - 30 hour engine out job. Do not wash it when hot as water can crack the manifolds - another engine out job. I am sure it was up for £9995, so £8400 looks a good price.

Live a bit ...............

Del
3/1/2009 4:09:47  


Posts: 2135
Since: 11/5/2005
Status: offline 		Oh yes if you have had Alfas you know all about the rust....why do we do it?

On the next subject.....

First let me make it quite clear....I have nothing negative to say about BobHoughton, I have no experience of them and I am sure they would be very diligent.

I observe this though....Ferrari specialists have generally become Maserati specialists since Ferrari took control of Maserati before it was passed on to Fiat / Alfa, the ownership becomes complicated! However the Ghibli was the last but one production car before Ferrari took control. There were probably less then a hundred imported into the UK and at the time the only Maserati dealership was Meridien. There are very few people who are factory trained on the Ghibli. Myles at Emblem is one and he used to work for Meridien when I first met him and bought my Ghibli. He knows the car inside out and where the anomalies in the workshop manual are!

Look at this way Pop down the M4 to junction 17 early one morning and have a spirited jaunt down the A350 before the traffic builds up and have the car looked after at Emblem.....maybe spend a day at the seaside or even an overnighter!

Just a thought! It is not as far as you might think and I have been to Cardiff a couple of times in November.

_____________________________

"Maser Malc"!!
4200 Spyder CC
Ghibli ABS
Mercedes ML320
www.essentialimages.co.uk



3/1/2009 16:19:32  
 

Posts: 55
Since: 2/1/2009
Status: offline 		Thanks for your thoughts and experiences Del, very useful....

I think you're possibly right Malcolm, Bob Houghton used to be a main Ferrari dealer before losing their franchise about 5 years ago, although they deal with classic Maseratis, its probably unlikely that they have huge experience of biturbo era cars.  It wouldn't actually be too much problem for me to go to Bournemouth for servicing, I have a friend in Poole so I could combine a service with a few beers.  I have seen a yellow Ghibli GT around Cardiff recently, if ever I see the driver, I'll perhaps try to have a chat.

I'm really not sure about how to go about inspections, the car I've seen is in Newcastle and I'm in Cardiff.  I can fly there easily enough to have a look myself but I'd like someone who really knows what they're doing to see it. 

Should I worry about the mileage on this car? Its 72000 but it had an engine rebuild at Meridian at 45000, presumably they would have done the cam chains at this time.  Bodywork looks tidy from photos but I've viewed cars in the past that looked good in the photos and were described as mint but were not that good.

Speaking of bodywork Malcolm, have you considered sending your car off to SPL (www.surfaceprocessing.co.uk)?  I am hoping to send my Alfa there when I've finished stripping it, as far as I'm concerned its the only way to totally eliminate rust permanently (although its a hell of a job stripping a car to a bare shell).  They charge £750 for the chemical strip and £750 for the galvanising dip.

Thanks again to everyone for all their help, I'll keep you posted

3/1/2009 18:52:48  

Posts: 555
Since: 9/3/2008
Region: Vikersund, Norway & Ashford, Kent
Status: offline 		dickyb

Welcome to the forum, the Ghibli GT looks tidy although pictures don't always tell the truth of course, Verde Tundra I believe, a very dark green that looks almost black when it's in the shade, certainly one of my top choices. You must have the car inspected by a specialist before purchase, I would insist that it be done by someone with long experience of this era. They will be able to do thorough checks on all known points of weakness, such as the Koni electronic dampers for example. The ride and handling will suffer if they are shot and the refurb of all four could easily set you back a cool 2 grand!

I think the Ghibli II is gorgeous, oozes understated Italian style and has a subtle and quietly aggressive stance, especially with the 17"s that are on there, exhaust is aftermarket but there's nothing wrong with that, my only criticism is the black Momo steering wheel which looks completely out of place, I love the original wood job, perhaps it comes with the car?

As far as the price in concerned I'm sure you can make an offer, wouldn't surprise me if the dealer paid half the amount he's asking for, these are wild times for car enthusiasts with cash to burn, if it stands up to scrutiny then go for it!!!


Malcom H

A 80s Honda on steroids?????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????

Steady on old chap....


For those who say the Ghibli II is not their cup of tea.

I've included a picture, just look at those lines, take in the handsome detailing and fuss-free finish, the absolutely exquisite c-pillars, no Honda similarities anywhere. Gandini's a genius and this is THE ultimate 90s Italian gentleman's express. I'm right and you're wrong.








Attachment (1)

< Message edited by Evoluzione -- 3/1/2009 19:45:40 >
4/1/2009 2:14:23  

Posts: 4164
Since: 5/6/2007
Status: offline 		Welcome back Marlon after the xmas  festivities,time to put the pink gin away till next year    hope it was a good one


regards loz


_____________________________

Old pompous spods current stable
52 plate 4200 cc Lowered Tubi's and full GS body kit,steering wheel and rack
55 plate 4200 cc Gransport Full Larini system,AP Racing big brake upgrade ,more stuff pending

4/1/2009 2:21:46  
 

Posts: 713
Since: 12/3/2007
Region: Hampshire
Status: offline 		A bit off topic I know, but some time ago the grapevine had it that Bob Houghton didn't lose the franchise as such, but did a deal with AN Other that would enable him to bank some dosh and presumably concentrate on the more exclusive models along with competition cars; the latter seems to be borne out by his website:

http://www.bobhoughtonferrari.co.uk/default.asp

I've never done business with the company but they are advertising Maserati services, so it may well be worth a call. Either way BH look as though they have an impeccable reputation and excellent taste in fine machinery.

PH
4/1/2009 2:57:45  

Posts: 4164
Since: 5/6/2007
Status: offline 		Very interesting site phil  excellent reading and pics

regards loz


_____________________________

Old pompous spods current stable
52 plate 4200 cc Lowered Tubi's and full GS body kit,steering wheel and rack
55 plate 4200 cc Gransport Full Larini system,AP Racing big brake upgrade ,more stuff pending

4/1/2009 4:17:23  

Posts: 555
Since: 9/3/2008
Region: Vikersund, Norway & Ashford, Kent
Status: offline 		Cheers loz, look forward to disagreeing throughout 2009

4/1/2009 5:19:03  


Posts: 2135
Since: 11/5/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: dickyb


Should I worry about the mileage on this car? Its 72000 but it had an engine rebuild at Meridian at 45000, presumably they would have done the cam chains at this time.  Bodywork looks tidy from photos but I've viewed cars in the past that looked good in the photos and were described as mint but were not that good.

Speaking of bodywork Malcolm, have you considered sending your car off to SPL (www.surfaceprocessing.co.uk)?  I am hoping to send my Alfa there when I've finished stripping it, as far as I'm concerned its the only way to totally eliminate rust permanently (although its a hell of a job stripping a car to a bare shell).  They charge £750 for the chemical strip and £750 for the galvanising dip.




I would want to know why the car needed an engine rebuild at a relatively low mileage? If they are properly maintained they are very tough motors and will last and last. Ours turned 50K on our recent trip to the Nurburgring and it is running like the proverbial sewing machine....we are now considering when we have the chains changed but they are still not noisy. I aquired it with around 23K miles in 2003 so we are over half it's history! It was used as a daily by me and then Rich who probaly put more miles on it than me but now it is just a toy for the track!

If Meridien did the rebuild then there is a good chance that it was Myles who did the work whilst he was there. Might be worth giving Emblem a call and see if he remembers it?

There are still some lower mileage models about but with these cars it is very much a compromise between bodywork over mileage, within reason. It will affect resale but then, sadly a Ghibli GT is unlikely to increase in value despite the scarcityand may be bottomed out? Who knows? Full service history and a stack of bills will help!

Re the bodywork: sadly if we had ours chemically stripped at the moment then the wings would look like collanders! I paid a local company, now defunct, a lot of money to have it all brought up to scratch glass out respray etc etc. Unfortunately although the finishing was the best the prep was not...a rip off in short! Since then Rich had McGraths carry out a lot of underside welding. It is basically sound but cosmetically poor. We could have the wings replaced or cut and shut or I might do that myself but as it is not a "daily" there is no pressure. Now it is stripped for the track I can access most of the other panels from inside and keep on top of it!



_____________________________

"Maser Malc"!!
4200 Spyder CC
Ghibli ABS
Mercedes ML320
www.essentialimages.co.uk



4/1/2009 5:22:47  


Posts: 2135
Since: 11/5/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Evoluzione

A 80s Honda on steroids?????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????

Steady on old chap....





You're right I should have said a '70's Honda on steroids!

I love the lines but especially the agressive front end....when you see one in the rear view mirror it has the menace to for people to pull over....more so than the spyder!

But it is basically a "3 box" saloon with some very clever coachlines!

_____________________________

"Maser Malc"!!
4200 Spyder CC
Ghibli ABS
Mercedes ML320
www.essentialimages.co.uk



12/1/2009 6:32:43  


Posts: 2135
Since: 11/5/2005
Status: offline 		Hi Dicky,

Have you moved any further ahead?

I was down at Emblem earlier today and both Myles and Tim are familiar with the car from their days at Meridien....Give them a ring

http://www.emblemsportscars.com/home.aspx



_____________________________

"Maser Malc"!!
4200 Spyder CC
Ghibli ABS
Mercedes ML320
www.essentialimages.co.uk



23/1/2009 5:51:24  
 

Posts: 55
Since: 2/1/2009
Status: offline 		Sorry chaps, I've been away and am very busy at the moment.  No progress yet, busy til about the middle of Feb so can't go and view the car til then (don't think its going anywhere in a hurry though!).  I'm hoping that if I bide my time I can get the car for around £7500 as it won't be too long before they'll be looking to get it shifted.......

Thanks for talking to the chaps at Emblem for me Malcolm, nice to hear they know the car (did they wince or anything when you mentioned it?).  I'll try to give them a call and will have a chat.

Many thanks to everyone for all their help

Rich
10/4/2009 13:20:13  
 

Posts: 55
Since: 2/1/2009
Status: offline 		sorry for the long absence, I've severely broken my arm and have been in plaster for 9 weeks with at least another 3 to go and could be up to 6 months in plaster!!!(broken my scaphoid for any medical types out there!)  As a result I can't drive so progress has halted for the time being.

I spoke to Myles at Emblem recently, what a helpful chap!  He knew the car and told me that the rebuild was done in around 2002 after the previous owner continued to drive around with a serious overheating problem.  He eventually blew the engine up and part exchanged the car for another.  Meridien then rebuilt the engine and sold it on.  As a result I think the car should be ok mechanically (assuming its been looked after properly since).

Hopefully I'll be able to look at the car soon...

I've found a company on the net that do inspections for Porsche and Ferrari, www.carinspections.co.uk, anyone heard of them?  Other than that I'm really struggling to find anyone suitable close enough to inspect it for me....

Thanks for all the help

Rich
16/5/2009 21:52:05  

Posts: 76
Since: 16/5/2009
Status: offline 		hey buddy well since ur up north, have u thought of autoshield? based in manchester and ask for russel, great guy n knows his stuff!!
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